Noticed a drop of oil last weekend while out with MarkCBXX and slvr(Roy). Lots of ideas on the causes, but I believe it is the oil being pushed through the wiring insulation. This could very easily go unnoticed if it does not drip. What I would like for you guys to do is check your 12's and see if you have an oily residue in this spot. Even on my 02, with only 1900 miles there is a oily film. Sitting at the back of the bike, just behind and above the passenger peg on the left side, you can pull down on the plastic and expose this area. Go check your bikes, you will need a flashlight, and let me know what you find.
Here's the pics of where to look........


[img]http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0MwD7d0EPzGvOTjNC7iKzHHlBpBolxtkzQBfx2G1RX5pJPhGBx v*X3u8XVWJPTgCmhNQVqTG!mcPEsjnz0q1zcg/DCP_0342.JPG[/img]

I encountered that same problem 2 different times on my 01...being I have a mirrored undertail I to have noticed the oil weeping spot.......I have completely dissasembled the machine...several times but to no avail.......who knows maybe our bikes have an auto chain lube option we don't kow about.... lol....Brian

</p>

If I was a gambling man I would bet my 12 on it MW. Just seal it off before your connectors have a short or it will be a mess like mine was.

Living life on two wheels
and living wild
on one</p>

a short???did u encounter a short because of this...one other question ...where is it coming from????if your believe it is being pushed through....from where????

"Be Nice to the Police Officer.......Ya Never Know When He Owns 12!!!!</p>

Hey MWR, could you put an arrow in there? I think I know where you are talking, but don't want to make a false assumption on this one.



- Blitz

"I only ride in first gear. An 83 mph ticket I can afford. "</p>

comes from the stator. The wiring harness is not sealed off from the oil it's in and can follow it right up to the connectors. The 12 makes quite a bit of positive crank case preasure. The oil then gets onto the conectors and causes a short and eventualy will melt and cause a voltage regulator malfunction.

This all happened to me last year.

Living life on two wheels
and living wild
on one</p>

& that makes me wonder..could this problem be caused by too much oil in the crankcase? I'm kinda picky about the amount of oil in my ride & never over fill it.

Just a theory



& if it's the CrankCase pressure? Then that's one more reason to do the CrankCase mod. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">

"Green Mamba" - Feeds mostly on Birds, almost flourescent green in color, can strike violently with extrodinary speed.
</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub56.ezboard.com/bkawasakizx12r.showLocalUserPublicProfile?login=gr eenmamba>GreenMamba</A> at: 7/10/02 7:02:02 pm

Blitz, the foam piece I am pulling down on fits around a round connector, I am guessing to prevent vibration, but it is that connector and the wires leading from it with the oil residue.

I did not have time to disassemble it tonight, but I will check it out on Saturday. You can see in the second pic to the right of my hand is where it seeped down and let a drop fall on the chain guard. If not for that one drop that fell I probally still would not know this was going on.



Green Mamba, I changed the oil and filter about 200 miles ago, I always change the filter when changing the oil. I always let it drain completely and put in 3 qts. It is 2/3 up on the sight window, which is perfect....

Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>

Well then, you've got the oil bases covered.

Think ya might try the CC mod?

before ya silicone the stator wiring.

"Green Mamba" - Feeds mostly on Birds, almost flourescent green in color, can strike violently with extrodinary speed.
</p>

Mark,



I just went out and FELT the ass end up....

And it was dry as a bone....Are you thinking the stator has oil in it that is leaking ?????

I wonder if it has to do with the wheelies ?

I dont know im just guessing..give Doug a call tomorrow maybe hell have an idea....



See Ya,

Slvr!





</p>

I'll check mine tonight. Hey Roy, my thoughts exactly about wheelies. They may have sometime to do with it. When folks respond, let's fess up to wheelies or not.

Not just a barbarian, a great barbarian!</p>

Green Mamba - I did not have any plans to do the crankcase mod, but that does not mean I will not sometime later on...



I rode in to work this morning. It is not leaking as you may think. Just a light film like the picture shows. I don't believe it would use any oil, but it very well could cause problems with the connections as previously stated......



I doubt wheelies would cause this, but I do sometimes let the engine slow the bike when riding hard, which I think may build a lot of pressure....Just throwing ideas around.....



Even though I'm under warranty, I'd rather fix it myself than take it to a dealer...

Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>

Here's the deal...when mine happened, I assumed it was from wheelies. How else could it get that high up the wires.... but when I dropped the bike off to get all the probs fixed, my mechanic was already aware of the problem. Said he heard someone talking about it at a tech class he went to.

He said wheelies would speed the transfer of oil but would eventualy end up at the connector anyways. He described to me just how much preasure that crankcase makes in the 12. No PCV mod would cure it but it wouldn't hurt.

I know this guy is a good mechanic, but I also know they can bullshit their way through anything. I just had him go ahead and fix the problem with silicon. He even went a step further and put the kind that is fuel/oil proof. Other wise...regular silicon would break down after a short time. He also replaced the whole wiring harness, stator, and voltage regulator.

Living life on two wheels
and living wild
on one</p>

what about cutting the insulation on the wire as a temporaray fix so that it wont seep all the way up ????

</p>

Hmmmmmmmm?? be better to keep the oil where it belongs, just don't know how much of a job pulling the stator cover off.

Living life on two wheels
and living wild
on one</p>

actually I was trying to edit my half brain response...lol.....If you fill the wire insulation with silicone you then "cap off the leak".....My concern is the silicone working its way lose in your engine case and then ultimately clogging up something else......Who Knows if oil can get in connectors on this machine....anything is possible.......Brian

"Be Nice to the Police Officer.......Ya Never Know When He Owns 12!!!!</p>

If this is that big an issue -- might be something Kawasaki shoul be handling as a recall or under warranty. This is the type of things that you have no control over and it could easily leave you stranded.



I hope there is no fire risk here? Oil and electricity? not likely but any opinions are welcome?

Tainui</p>

T, I'm sure they would cover it under warranty. My main concern was this was happening on more 12's and not being noticed. I think the most serious thing that could happen would be shorting out the wiring.......

Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>

About the oil and fire/electrical.....damn right it can burn and burn quick. My bike was real close to catching on fire. After looking at the wiring harness and connectors, I don't know why the bike didn't burn to the ground.

Living life on two wheels
and living wild
on one</p>

I wondered what the hell that crap was. Had that stuff smokin once, (coming from underneath the seat).



Only way I could pull the connectors apart was with a knife.



Smells like wet cigarette butts.



So guess it aint chain lube.

<a href="http://zx-12r.servebeer.com/" target="_blank">

</a> </p>

I'll try this pic again....





Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub56.ezboard.com/umwrzx12.showPublicProfile?language=EN>mwrzx12</A> at: 7/16/02 3:50:23 am

OK, that pic worked. That connector was full of oil<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/eek.gif ALT=":eek"> <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/eek.gif ALT=":eek">

Cleaned it all out, and tried to seal at that end....

But I had other problems on Sunday.........

See other thread....

Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>

I suggest everyone take a look at their bikes. It's a very simple fix, but if it is neglected or not cought in time, fire could result.

Living life on two wheels
and living wild
on one</p>

I agree with Mono. I was very surprised to find that connector was full of oil... I have a pic but for some reason I can't get it to post. Anyways, it was a mess...........

Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>

I wish I had pics of mine when it was all a melted gob of shit. I might see if the dealer still has the parts. It was hard to believe the bike didn't catch on fire. Electrical fires are hard to put out too.

Living life on two wheels
and living wild
on one</p>

yeah, you got me thinking when you said yours melted,

no room on the 12 for an extinguisher <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol">

Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>

Nancy fit one on the green monster...except it's blue, not red.<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol"> <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol">

Living life on two wheels
and living wild
on one</p>

I just checked mine on the outside, and its clean as a bone. 5500 miles but no moon shot wheelies either.



I just had the tail off last Saturday and would prefer not to have to do it again. If the problem is occurring, do you actually have to pull the connector to be sure, or will the oil film be present in the area, or do we just not know for sure at this point?



If this is happening, and they know about it, then Kawasaki better send out recall number four.

"Winter is natures way of saying "Up yours."</p>

Has everyone checked their tail for this problem with oil in the tail connectors?



I have followed mwzx12's thread and told EPSTEIN about it. I just got a call from him and it seems he is having the same problems, and one of the wires has cooked itself and split.



Please reply to this if you are experiencing the same problems - you may be at risk of an electrical fire at worst and stranded on the roadside at least!!!



I will be going out shortly to check my connectors for this oil leak and post my findings.



We may have to address Kawasaki on this if there are enough of us riding around with this problem.

Tainui



Her R6

Rookie

Posts: 1

(7/16/02 2:10:40 pm)

Reply | Edit | Del Re: RE: OIL LEAK in connectors

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hell yeah. There oil all over mine. Mine has also cooked itself.

It was getting so hot we had to unplug one of the wire's. I'm

taking my bike to the shop this evening so they can check it out.



IWasBlitz

Scary Fast M.F.

Posts: 1096

(7/16/02 2:46:33 pm)

Reply | Edit | Del

Re: RE: OIL LEAK in connectors

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So am I correct that the suspicion is that the oil is traveling inside the insulation, from the stator to the rear plug harness?



Man, that ain't good if thats whats happening...

"Winter is natures way of saying "Up yours."



TENN12

Polishing M.F.

Posts: 1845

(7/16/02 2:49:03 pm)

Reply | Edit | Del

Re: RE: OIL LEAK in connectors

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Oop's. The above post by "Her R6" is mine.

Stupid hurts.



IWasBlitz

Scary Fast M.F.

Posts: 1098

(7/16/02 3:16:11 pm)

Reply | Edit | Del

Re: RE: OIL LEAK in connectors

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Never mind, I found mdw's post on page 2. Its all explained there.



Can we discuss there so we don't have two same subject threads going?

"Winter is natures way of saying "Up yours."





"Winter is natures way of saying "Up yours."</p>

I checked mine, no oil leak at 2,600 miles. I run it like a raped ape...but no wheelies, no synth oil (which trys like hell to find a way to seep out of engines) and mine 'was' over-filled (by the sight glass).



Rich

02' 12R "red"</p>

Thanks Blitz, that was the reason I originally started this was to get everyone to check their bikes due to how easy this is to overlook until it is to late. Remeber one drop of oil is all I saw drip, but I saw it and knew something was wrong.

There are some guys over at Bikeland having the same problems. I have a picture on the 1st page of this thread that shows the connector. Remove your seat, and it is right there. No need to remove anything but the seat to check the connector. The hardest thing to do was getting the connector apart.

I hope everyone takes this seriously, and if not, ask Mono what can happen. PLEASE CHECK YOURS CLOSELY!!

FIRE HAZARD!!!!



More pics on my sitegroups.msn.com/Marks2002ZX12R/shoebox.msnw

Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>

I know I must sound like a broken record but I would have never checked the connectors if I hadn't seen oil dripping first. The inside of the connector is where the problem starts. Once the connectors burn and short out, the wires will soon follow and travel down the harness until it's too late...fire, voltage regulator, or ECU damage, and in my case....all the above.

Living life on two wheels
and living wild
on one</p>

Exactly Mono, I just have the feeling this problem is more widespread than anyone realizes.....Maybe if I keep this on page 1 at least the zx-12r.org guys will be safe...



I checked an 01 in a parking lot today, it was dry......

Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>

Just checked my 00 model. All good, dry as a bone.

KIWI=A small flightless bird which Eats, Roots, and Leaves.</p>

Smart advice says pull the connection and then check it, correct?

"Winter is natures way of saying "Up yours."</p>

MWR, I agree, we'll stick this baby up top for awhile until we are all satisfied we know whats going on. No need to keeping TOPping it.



Done.

"Winter is natures way of saying "Up yours."</p>

Correct, only takes a couple minutes. Take the two 10mm bolts out of your seat and remove the seat.The connector is on the left side and is very easy to reach....



Let's try a pic or two...Boys and Girls that is oil in my electrical connection <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/eek.gif ALT=":eek"> <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/eek.gif ALT=":eek"> <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/eek.gif ALT=":eek">



[img]http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0MwDyGUYPnmzOTjNC7iKzHHUxpGjaja*oUWbLjI7mn8kVklV0U PpONJUJBvRQ47wcYDhykygtudbIj*iKUnSRIA/DCP_0347.JPG[/img]



[img]http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0NAD**3gPXHfOTjNC7iKzHFlfxfMHsWZmXygozSDByXZAz!LUu 99DrJ4*Kf8w0nLG!bhgnuHuJMI5dC4m*NNr6Q/DCP_03490.JPG[/img]

Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub56.ezboard.com/umwrzx12.showPublicProfile?language=EN>mwrzx12</A> at: 7/16/02 5:34:03 pm

Could be my resolution, but in the 2nd pic, is that actually oil in the bottom 1/3 or so of the plug you are holding?

"Winter is natures way of saying "Up yours."</p>

Blitz I was shocked how much oil was in there. Sorry about the resolution, I tried to get a clear picture, I angled it for the photo and the bottm corner was full, maybe a spoonful????



My wife was there when I pulled the connector apart, and oil went all over my face and shirt, several obscenities later, what you see is what was left, it was full of oil when I pulled it apart<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/eek.gif ALT=":eek"> <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/eek.gif ALT=":eek">





Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>

Shit, that is a serious problem!!!!!!

KIWI=A small flightless bird which Eats, Roots, and Leaves.</p>

Cool, we are gonna work through this one.



I'm calling Kawasaki's Bat Line tomorrow. I want answers, dammit! <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/eek.gif ALT=":eek">

"Winter is natures way of saying "Up yours."</p>

Goodluck Blitz....they told my dealer to silicon the new wire harness at the stator. I was satisfied until someone just mentioned on this thread, about the silicon braking down and falling into the engine. Don't think that would do damage but I don't like the sound of it.

Living life on two wheels
and living wild
on one</p>

Damn, I'm just now reading this. I wish I would've got a few pic's of my

connector, it's toasted pretty good. I'll let you guy's know what my local

dealer say's. It might be awhile, there's a ton of bike's in their shop right

now.<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/frown.gif ALT=":(">

Stupid hurts.</p>

So far the list of people having these issues is:

mwrzx12

EPSTEIN

Mono12r (previously)

Major Konig ZX12R

TENN12

NameChanger - not visible but present in the connector



I just checked mine and there was no oil present in the area or inside the switch.....for now.

Tainui</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub56.ezboard.com/bkawasakizx12r.showLocalUserPublicProfile?login=ta inuinyc>TainuiNYC</A>* at: 7/17/02 5:34:22 am

Now we know who the wheelie folks are...<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol"> <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol"> <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol">



Out of 900 members I suspect the list would be greater if people knew about the prob and where to look.

Living life on two wheels
and living wild
on one</p>

I have to make a retraction of my earlier statement. There was NO oil around the area leaking BUT I took the plug apart and there IS OIL IN THERE!!! No oil in the big connection, just the smaller one.



I flooded the area with electrical contact cleaner and blew it out with a compressed air.



So add me to the list.



"No-Wheelie" Rich

02' 12R "red"</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub56.ezboard.com/unamechanger.showPublicProfile?language=EN>NameCha nger</A> at: 7/17/02 5:04:41 am

I just wanted to mention that Oil is not very conductive folks. It's NOT going to cause a short anywhere, trust me.



On the other hand, I'm not saying this isn't a problem either, it is a problem. I just don't want you guys getting all concerned about Electrical shorts, etc. when you have nothing to worry about there.





I'll check my bike tonight! It's an 00' model.

</p>

... how many 12R owners were having this problem.



I personally have not, but there are at least five threads dating back to Oct. 2001 that specifically address this problem at The Zone. I just used "wiring harness" as a search phrase.

</p>

exactly redelk, when I saw that one drop of oil I did a search here, nothing, did a search over at the zone and found a couple threads, but very few posts about it.........



I do all my posting here, but I have put a link up over there,

and I hope to get enough attention to this problem...



I felt it was possibly a major problem for 12 owners, hence my effort to get everyone just to check their bikes,



We already have several members here that did not know they had this problem, and if we helped one member it was worth the effort....



Mono has already posted how his harness melted as a result of this defect....



Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>

EPSTEIN has discolored wires and is planning on taking the bike to the dealer Friday/SAturday.



Has anyone contated the dealer yet on this?

If so, which one?

what have they said is the cause?

remedy?

how long is it going to take for replacement parts?

Is this an under warranty replacement?



I recognize these may be somewhat redundant questions. but a couple clear anwsers and posts on your experience with your dealer may assist in how we talk to our local dealers.



Thanks all.

Tainui</p>

ok this will sound really weird,....but just think about it and ponder the possibilities.



Knowing that there are a few people that have had an overheated wire, one can assume that there is something there with either a high voltage draw or amp draw or something.



What if the oil is there to act as a coolant on that hot wire?!?!





</p>

Ok, I have a question to all who have/had oil in their connectors.



I just checked mine and it's dry, but while I was checking I noticed something. The wiring loom that carries the wires stops about an inch from the connector exposing the actual colored wire jackets (insulation). (if you look close at the picture in mwrzx12's post it is the same way) so I ask this, if the oil is indeed traveling up the loom then why wouldn't you see it all over the outside of the connector as well?

Also the connector top (where the wires go in) seems to be pretty tight so I can't see how the oil is getting into the connector unless it's spilling over the edge and getting in that way because the connector snaps into the other half from the top thus allowing a way for oil to get in.

So please tell me if the oil is traveling in the loom or the actual wire insulation (I doubt it's the actual insulation, I can't believe there would be any room inside the wire jacket)

I didn't check at the stator but if the wire loom stops short of the end (like it does at the connectors) then there would be no way for oil to get in from that end, it would just spill out of the stator. There is also tape on the ends that would make this even more difficult to get into the harness.

So what is it?



Thanks,



BigJ12





</p>

BigJ, in my case there was oil on the outside of the connector. I had so much in mine it had ran down the foam padding and dripped on the chain guard. You are correct in that the wiring loom stops about 1 inch from the connector. And I still don't fully understand how the oil got up there...

Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>

we can add another from the zone....



<blockquote>Quote:<hr> phil





Novice Class

Posts: 89

posted July 17, 2002 08:48 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Interesting, I was thinking this was just an `00 problem. Apparently not. Mines been dripping off and on for over a year now, just started again a few weeks ago. When the bike, an `00, was just off of warranty my dealer called kawasaki about it to see if they would fix it and the guy actually laughed at him. I didn`t think they would cover it but thought I`d ask. <hr></blockquote>

Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>

{image}www.printroom.com/_vti_bi...l?{/image}

</p>

well, we can add another from the zone...

we have at least 8 now....



<blockquote>Quote:<hr> xman99





Parking Attendant

Posts: 8

posted July 18, 2002 07:06 AM Edited By: xman99 on 18 Jul 2002 07:07

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First time I saw it on mine I thought chain lube had somehow gotten up there. Then pulled the connector apart and figured maybe some insulating goop inside the connector body eventually melted from heat. It's definitely oil pumped up from the alternator. I slid back the wire loom at the connector and the wires were soaked in oil as far as I could see. Shot some electronics cleaner down the wire loom towards the source. I pulled my alt cover off and sealed the area around the wire exit with RTV - only inside the 90 degree rubber grommet. Hopefully it holds, between this and my recently failed radiator fan switch I'm not happy with how this bike is holding up after just one year. Was going to reply on zx-12r.org but cannot for the life of me get registered for some reason.

____________

2001 Silver Zx-12R <hr></blockquote>

Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>

Lets get something straight.....if oil is not very conductive then why do we( as an Electrician) use Diolectric oil in transformers(wet transformers)??? If there is a bad connection and even a slight elctrical arc, then that oil will burn like crazy. Take a can of WD-40, spray it and hold a match up to it. You will have an awesome flame thrower. An electrical arc, from a short or bad connection, etc... is alot hotter than a flame, so burning that oil in the connector will be easy and act as an excellerator.

When I picked my bike up from getting all my wires, regulator, and stator replaced, I had a chance to study it some. It most definately started in the conector and worked it's way down the harness. Oil was quite visible inside the protective covering, and also slightly on the outside. Most of the oil on the outside would drip away though and not be very noticable.

I also pondered the idea on how the hell it could get into the connector from the inside of the covering. I concluded that it must have came from the outside and worked is way through the cracks surrounding the outside of the connector.

Just keep an eye on things folks and stop the prob before ya actualy have to wonder why your wirs are burnt up.

Living life on two wheels
and living wild
on one</p>

<blockquote>Quote:<hr> Take a can of WD-40, spray it and hold a match up to it. You will have an awesome flame thrower. <hr></blockquote>

Excellent imagery on the WD-40 can, but, on that note, why do people spray WD-40 in their distributor caps when the inside has gotten wet?? It's because the WD-40 displaces the water and it is *not* electrically conductive. If it were conductive, the car would backfire like crazy!

On the flame thrower aspect of WD-40 and it's ilk, it's actually the PROPELLENT in WD-40 that is most flammable, ......way more than the lubricant itself.

Ditto for spraypaints, and other cans we have fun with! <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">



The oil you mentioned in transformers is actually there more for to it's HEAT DISSIPATION. If it were actually conductive, then it would defeat the purpose of the coils in the transformer, right?



It isn't so easy to compare the ability of something being ELECTRICALLY conductive compared to it's FLAMMABLILITY. It's different!! They're two different scales. Wood burns like crazy right, but it sure as hell ain't good at passing electricity! <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">



"..An electrical arc, from a short or bad connection, etc... is alot hotter than a flame,... "

The heat created by electrical arc'ing is directly proportional to how much AMP's and VOLTAGE you are dealing with. I wouldn't say that an arc is always going to be hotter than a flame. It would always depend upon how many amps and volts you're pushing.





















</p>

..that all being said.... I'm still not saying that the oil is supposed to be there! I only brought up the cooling effect and non-conductivity to try to ease concerns of fires a little bit, and to try to get us all to look at all possibilities for what we're seeing here.

Ya gotta admit, it's pretty odd, since some are seeing it, and some are not!





maybe we need more info about OIL LEVELS for the bikes that see the problem?!?!?? <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)">





</p>

Set three quarts aside, always change the filter, drain completely, fill new filter up "twice" and put the remainder in..

Sight glass will show 2/3.....

Mark-PMB-2002 ZX12R </p>